In this enlightening conversation, Dr. Kim D'Eramo shares her journey from traditional medicine to exploring the profound connection between mind and body in healing. She discusses the importance of addressing emotional roots of physical symptoms, the power of letting go, and the tools for self-awareness and healing. The conversation also touches on the future of medicine, emphasizing the need for a more holistic approach that recognizes the body's innate ability to heal itself. Movement and emotional expression are highlighted as essential components of the healing process.

Takeaways

• Miraculous healing involves expanding our understanding of science.
• Emotions are often the root cause of physical ailments.
• Personal health crises can lead to transformative journeys.
• Letting go of fear can facilitate healing.
• Self-awareness is crucial for healing.
• The body has the ability to heal itself.
• Movement and sound can aid in emotional release.
• The future of medicine lies in holistic approaches.
• Practitioners are awakening to new healing modalities.
• Everything is possible when we open ourselves to healing.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Background

01:00 The Fourth Wave of Therapy: Mind-Body Medicine

08:39 Dr. D'Eramo's Personal Journey of Healing

15:11 The Power of Awareness, Breath, and Movement in Healing

35:14 Movement as a Tool for Transmutation

Keywords: miraculous healing, mind-body connection, emotional health, personal journey, self-awareness, future of medicine, movement therapy, holistic healing, emotional release, conscious healthcare

This is unedited.

Dr Peta Stapleton (00:01.184)
Welcome back everybody. And I'm absolutely thrilled. It's taken me a while to nail this lady down only because we probably weren't doing the right email sequencing and things like that. But I am absolutely blessed to be in the company today of a fabulous person who is not only somebody that we've hosted here in Australia, but I'm hoping Kim, it's okay to kind of say that, you know, we're kind of on the same path here and at some level, probably kindred spirits. So.

I'm thrilled to welcome Dr. Kim D 'Armaux to the podcast studio today. How are you, Kim?

Kim D'Eramo, DO (00:33.71)
Thank you. It's such an honor. I think so highly of you. So what a beautiful introduction. I'm so grateful you reached out and I'm glad to be a part of this.

Dr Peta Stapleton (00:38.08)
Oh, thank you. This is about you today, not me. So that will all come out in the watch. So Kim's full bio is below. So you can absolutely have a look and a read and just historically a little bit about Kim's background and history because she hails from the field of medicine and medical science.

And in a previous life was a board registered and certified physician. However, we're going to get into where that's sort of taken her because that's where your journey started. But Kim, really, you know, the theme of this podcast is very much about the fourth wave of therapy. And that does include mind, body medicine and, you know, everything and where that takes us. And I really want to, you know, your website and the link is below.

has this amazing quote that opens, if you go to the, you know, about Kim Page, this quote, which sort of says, miraculous healing is not going against science, it's taking science one step further, that kind of thing. I really want to open with that concept and ask you about your ideas, you know, what is it, what do you mean by that? What do you mean that miraculous healing?

kind of take science a step further.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (01:57.166)
We are all the time coming upon new understandings in science and realizing everything we thought was absolute truth is actually like, whoa, that's not true at all. So we're constantly revising the way we see the world. And so when we have things that happen, it's not a matter of saying, yeah, no, we know that can't happen because science says we gotta do it the other way around. Like, whoa, unbelievable things are happening. I wonder.

how do we explain that? And then we really do find the explanation, but we've got to move into a new mind and a new perception and sort of like a curiosity and be open to what we don't already understand before we then begin to understand it. And certainly as a physician, I have taken it upon myself to look under every stone for what are the solutions when people say nothing can be done. Well, what's actually possible? And to look for myself.

personally, for my patients, for people in my life to really like explore. And that requires us to be open -minded and learn new things we don't already know.

Dr Peta Stapleton (03:01.728)
It's so true, you know, and you must see, you know, this at a patient level, that patients come in with the physical kind of presentation, if you like. But, you know, like how common is it that stress, emotional distress is presenting as a physical symptom and, you know, people obviously seek some sort of intervention at that body level.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (03:24.174)
When physical things are not getting better, no matter what we do, 100 % of the time in my practice, there have been emotions and underlying beliefs and ways of thinking that are keeping those things in place. So it doesn't mean like we're never meant to have any of those experiences. We're meant to grow from our experiences. But when we're like trying everything, nothing's working and it's time going by and you know, there's a root cause that's not being addressed.

And so on the energetic level, the emotions or the belief systems, or, you know, it's going to have a stay at that same frequency and keep that energy in place. And we just keep getting the result over and over.

Dr Peta Stapleton (04:03.68)
And do you find that there are common emotions, you know, despite presentation, whether that's, you know, a skin rash or something a bit more serious, are there common emotions that kind of play at that foundation level?

Kim D'Eramo, DO (04:16.11)
Yes, so when we have energy that's been suppressed, whether it's like, yeah, a skin rash or something, you know, our skin is the largest detoxification organ, something's trying to express its way out, the body's trying to rebalance itself, and then we like slap on a bunch of steroid and like, we suppress that from happening, the energy has to go deeper. And the things that most often get suppressed are fear and shame. So like guilt is the flavor of that.

But a lot of us are just living in constant fear. And so whether it's adrenal fatigue or like a chronic Epstein -Barr virus or Lyme disease or infection that isn't clearing, that's the immune system is suppressed, so we're not clearing this thing that we should be clearing. A lot of times fear keeps the nervous system in that cycle of being overrun. Our adrenals are just totally, you know, cranking it out. The thyroid gets shot. Someone can present with Hashimoto's.

brain fog, chronic fatigue, or yeah, an infection that's not getting better, or even inflammatory diseases like cancer, MS. There are so many that have fear at the root of what is keeping the system from healing itself. And then the other one is that, you know, shame, guilt, and so often these are unconscious. So I've had a lot of people saying, no, no, no, no, no, this is physical.

I don't have any of that other stuff going on. Yeah, consciously, because 100 % of the time I've seen when people have chronic stuff that's not getting better, whether it's pain or disease, there's always been some major emotions. And when we shift those, the body heals.

Dr Peta Stapleton (05:51.424)
You just said something right at the start of that. I want to backtrack just a little bit. You said the skin's the largest organ in the body and often, and I don't know what the percentage is, will something show at a physical skin level? And you then said before it goes inwards, I want to come back to that because I'm sure a lot of people may have experienced, you know, some sort of rash or dermatitis or something at a skin level. And is that common that it shows there at that outside level first?

Kim D'Eramo, DO (06:20.302)
It is. So we've got the four main pillars for detoxification. So you've got your colon, your liver, your kidneys, your skin, your body's trying to always rebalance itself. In fact, the old doctors, you know, before the system got kind of taken over into one thing, they would give you an enema. They would help the colon. They'd help your body detoxify because they knew if we can get those detoxification pathways open, the body's going to handle the rest of the equation. And so...

They would never have done a lot of the stuff we're doing now and but once we do support that you know if your skin is trying to kind of like purge something out you want to assist that Doesn't mean there's no role ever for steroids and someone's so flared up You know help them out, but don't think you've actually solved the problem you want to assist that so castor oil would be a far better medication or approach because it's got a pole

all the stuff out and it's going to assist that skin barrier in doing what it's designed to do, which is detoxification. You may find that person gets radically better. However, you do the opposite. You suppress it back in, you put steroids or whatever. They keep giving that dairy or like whatever stimulating them to begin with. You're pushing that toxin, so to speak, back into the body. So it's going to go to a deeper level. So now you're going to have like either...

gut problems, you have now like inflammatory bowel disease or digestive issues or allergies. A lot of people are developing allergies because we're suppressing those detoxification organs or a worsening disease. And then it will go like to the mental and the emotional level where that person's system can't work it out on the physical level. We just keep giving medications to suppress symptoms. It will go to the mental emotional level.

There's so many things like psychiatric illnesses that are actually linked to toxicity at the physical level, heavy metal toxicity and mercury or other inflammatory conditions that then go to that mental level and they present and it will be labeled schizophrenia or bipolar or there's a whole slew of things. But have we really looked at what's actually causing that to kick in and take place?

Dr Peta Stapleton (08:39.456)
Yeah, absolutely. And I'm sure anyone listening in might be starting to identify different things that might be happening for themselves, but even, you know, in family members and friends, that kind of thing. But tell me, and just in case our listeners are new to this conversation, how is it that you found this as, you know, a very traditionally trained physician and going through that standard kind of pathway? And God forbid, one of my daughters wants to follow this pathway too. So.

What happened? Like, you know, what is it in a nutshell? How did you find this?

Kim D'Eramo, DO (09:10.734)
It was personal and all the doctors I know or like practitioners who are doing outside the box things almost all of them have had like a personal health crisis or something that like whoa this doesn't fit and they'll explore for themselves right and like I said before you're gonna look under every stone you got to get yourself better I had a vision of who I wanted to be in the world and I wanted to be a doctor and I wanted to make a difference and so I wasn't gonna let someone just tell me

Oh, sorry, you're never gonna run again and you're gonna just be sick for the rest of your life. And so that's what happened in medical school. I developed a severe autoimmune disease. I was told I would never be able to run again. I was told I'd be on medications for life and I'd have to just live with this and here's how it's gonna go. It's gonna get worse. And something inside me knew I had actually studied mind body medicine and I thought, okay, what's actually going on here? I had explored, you know, medical options. I was...

freaked out, really scared. I had chronic fatigue and all kinds of severe joint pain. And I thought, what the heck is happening? But I kind of kept knocking on that door of the allopathic model. Those were the doctors I was learning from. That's who I was with every day to find the answer what's happening. And finally, you know, my labs were showing lots of inflammation. I got sent to an allergist. I mean, I'd probably seen a dozen doctors. And then finally, this one guy in Boston told me, you've got blah, blah, blah, late onset.

rheumatoid arthritis, late onset juvenile rheumatoid arthritis. And I sat there and wanted to like, just cry and turn into a puddle on the floor. My whole life of going to the end rotations and travel, you're in a different hospital every month, just dissolving before my eyes. And then I thought, wait a minute, is this actually true for me? Why is my body all of a sudden inflamed?

Why is my body all of a sudden reacting and allergic to like everything? And what would it take for my body to be in balance? And I immediately, you know, I thanked him, I left there, but went to connect with myself and kind of have a talk with my body of like, who would I need to be that my body could heal this? And I saw immediately that there was this underlying, you know, sort of fear trigger thing of I've got to...

Kim D'Eramo, DO (11:33.134)
Constantly go go go go overcome push through power over and I was on this like race to avoid failure It wasn't just about inspiration. I was truly inspired to become a doctor I had a powerful vision for changing the face of medicine and how we've seen it as a very you know Just the tip of the iceberg of what's really going on and I knew better so I had this vision but there was this massive layer of

failure, like fear of inadequacy, of like, oh, I better keep proving myself and overcoming and pushing through. And I didn't at the time even know where that came through. I really do now studying my past history and family and stuff like that. But at the time it was like, oh, wow. But what was unconscious became conscious because I finally got ready to just be present. I stopped asking, what's wrong with me? What's wrong with me? And

fearfully trying to like get out of it and I finally let go and was able to see all of this and I let go that day I was like, nope, that is not what I need to do. My life is not about a journey to avoid this inevitable failure that my mind somehow thinks is going to happen. I can let that go and just be who I'm here to be and my inspiration will bring me through. And that day literally I let go of.

known and unknown, whatever was holding that together. There was a release, there was a clarity, and that was really the awareness is what allowed the healing. And within days, my physical body completely released the whole syndrome.

Dr Peta Stapleton (13:12.64)
Wow, and is that common? Like you do read, you know, books of miraculous healing or spontaneous remission from a whole range of different illnesses and disease. And you're not the first person I've heard say within a couple of days, those physical symptoms just left. Like, is that a common thing with that point of release?

Kim D'Eramo, DO (13:31.918)
I will say absolutely yes. And I was like for a year and a half struggling with this. I understood mind -body connection, mind over matter. But within days of truly getting it, when I let go, because the body is being fed by the mind. And once you let that go, you come into peace, you come into an interconnection, boom, your now physical body is being fed.

from that point of harmony. And so mine wasn't even like an instantaneous miraculous healing. It was days during those days. You know, the pain would come up. I'd notice the trigger. I'd notice the fear and I'd say, no, my body is perfectly healthy. And I'd repeat letting it go and let it go and keep remembering over and over. And then it was within like that week. My body no longer went into that pattern anymore. There are people who've had

you know, even quicker. Granted, sometimes we got to kind of get that clarity that I got that day. It can take a few months for us to like stop looking, looking, wait, wait, why? Just tell me why it's not working as they're like tap, tap, tapping away, trying to get rid of the symptoms. I actually had the insight and I knew there was nothing to get rid of. It was just can I be a different me? Can I let go of being the one who's running from the dragon of failure?

And just remember, who I am is a success. Who I am is enough to create the vision I have. And that's really what allows such a quick physical resolution.

Dr Peta Stapleton (15:11.232)
And you mentioned a couple of things, you know, a moment ago you said about talking to your body and almost asking it, what do you need to be able to, you know, heal, release that kind of thing? And were there tools, you just mentioned tapping, but were there tools that you were using in that couple of days, that clarity process to be able to, you know, have those conversations, affirm your body was whole anyway, that type of thing.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (15:37.87)
Yes, and this is the foundation for everything I do now because affirmations are kind of like just nothing. I don't want to swear, but like BS, you're like, that's not going to get you anywhere if you don't first get your power back. So if I had said, I'm healthy and strong, I'm healthy and strong, but stayed in that fear state, nothing's going to happen. What happened was,

and interconnection. Now, I wouldn't have been able to tell you this at the time, but years and years of teaching this, I absolutely have a three -step system. You've got to A, get your awareness back here in the body. As soon as you're triggered, especially with fear, you're off in the future. What you hope doesn't happen, what you hope does happen, attachment. When you're in anger, resentment, you're in the past. Oh my gosh.

I should never have blah, blah, blah. Or if only this hadn't happened and now your energy is back there. You don't have access to it when you do past, future. You're dissipating your energy. There's other ways we give our power away. So what if I get my power back here now? I don't have to be afraid of what I'm feeling. I don't have to be afraid of what's happening. Then I can show up. Hey, body, here we are. Show me.

And so it was about talking to my body, but it was more about listening. Am I actually here perceiving, letting in the sensation and the awareness of what my body's trying to tell me? Am I receptive? Because I wasn't all that year of trying so hard to get the answer. That is not receptivity, but that day in the doctor's office really was curiosity. Like, wait a minute.

what would it be if I could release this? Who would I have to be? What would have to happen in my body to let my body rebalance? And so that shift of deeper listening and presence is really the first part.

Dr Peta Stapleton (17:41.664)
Yeah and it seems like you know it has such a present moment mindfulness element to it that it's about not future not past which often people are trying to with lots of integrative techniques go back in the past and clean it up and you know and all of that has a place absolutely and obviously I research one of them but that present moment what's going on right here right now and

And I love that questioning. We were off air talking about Sedona as an area in America, but it's almost the Sedona method, those questions. I'll put a link below if anyone's curious about the Sedona method, but the questioning about what would it have to take? Is it possible for this to happen now? I have goosebumps while I'm saying these questions. You know, what would have to happen and am I open to that? And could it happen now? Like that really present minded kind of moment in time, isn't it?

Kim D'Eramo, DO (18:35.182)
When we ask a question, we get into the frequency of the answer. And so when I was asking, what's wrong with me? What's wrong with me? Yeah, doctor after doctor showing me, oh, I think it's this. Oh, wait, we found out it's this. Maybe it's that. And it was just more fear. And none of it you could do anything about. But when I started to ask, what do I need to see here? What's right about this I'm not getting? What's right about this I wasn't getting was life was actually creating the whole syndrome.

to show me that life was not about a self -improvement program. Because it wasn't just about finishing medical school and like succeeding as a physician. It was my entire experience on the planet was changed of who I attracted in my relationships to go on and have, you know, a child just before 40 and then my second right before I was 45. Like that's a miracle. My husband that I even found this being in my life who's so...

so supportive and so able to see me is like a needle in a haystack. So life had all that in store for me, but who do I need to be to receive that? It was so much bigger than just get rid of my symptoms and heal this disease, like which probably is what I wanted at the time. Just make it go away and like let me continue along this fear trajectory. No, life had something way bigger in store for me. And when I received...

what's right about this I'm not getting, that's when it started to come in.

Dr Peta Stapleton (20:05.76)
I love what you just said and I'm going to try and remember this because I think this is absolutely the theme of this conversation. You know, when you said when we ask the question, we get into the frequency of the answer and I can again, goosebumps. But if someone's listening in and saying, I want to take these steps, I want to be open to listening and healing. And yes, they might be, you know, tapping into and feeling into that fear that is present there.

What would be something that could support someone in their journey? And they may well want to reach out to, you know, different practitioners and, you know, physicians that might be able to support this journey. But what are some practices that people could take and use in their daily life to access some of this?

Kim D'Eramo, DO (20:51.726)
So that first step of getting your power here is the awareness. So my tool is an ABC tool. It's called the instant elevation. Instant because your electrophysiology actually shifts instantaneously. Can be a lag time for the physical and the chemical and hormonal to sort of reflect that. But the electromagnetic shift is registered instantaneously. We have the technology for that.

The second piece though is now to breathe into what arises. If I get into presence, I'm no longer in fear, running from the dragon, okay body, I'm here. You're gonna feel stuff, you're gonna notice stuff, and you wanna have a way to move that. So the breath, shifting, deepening, just like slow the breath, deepen the breath, just soft body. If all I do is soften my body, I'm gonna amplify.

that power coming back here now. I'm going to amplify the awareness step one, the sensation. And a lot of people, they don't, they don't like that at first. They think I shouldn't have the sensation. I don't know. What if you welcome the sensation? So that's the third part is I'm going to choose to be where I am. A lot of times we're choosing to feel better, to get better, to get to the next thing and like escape where I am. But that, you know, what you resist persists. It's just going to create more.

the same. That was certainly true for me. What if I choose to be here? Now I'm kind of amplifying that first part again and bringing more power here and bring more energy here and I'm breathing, I'm moving the energy through. You are your own healer. And so you don't have to be afraid of what arises when you soften your body, when you let go, you're going to shift your breathing, which changes your brain, changes your physiology, your hormones really toward that.

relaxation response that health body healing itself and then you just want to you know ABC your awareness shift your breathing and then I choose to be here with myself self -acceptance you can choose I love myself as I am that's a hard one to do when you're like no no I don't like this well I'm just gonna choose to be with the moment I'm in right now because it's always moving it's always changing and your presence is what is healing it.

Dr Peta Stapleton (23:13.76)
Yeah, amazing. And I'm hoping that maybe even people are kind of just listening in now and even just taking some of those breaths and softening because I was doing that while you were just talking and just felt my hips kind of, you know, we sit a lot in these jobs, just sort of, you know, soften a little bit there. And I think you're absolutely right. Coming back into the body is ultimately the answer here, isn't it? You know, because this is where illness and disease is presenting from. But at the same time, it's where the healing comes from as well.

And tell me, where's the medical field? And I know, you know, part of your journey has taken you in some other directions as well, but where's it at with the embracing of these kinds of ideas and concepts in what we would probably talk about as the fourth wave of medicine and therapy?

Kim D'Eramo, DO (24:01.742)
The fourth wave of medicine is going to emerge from individuals, not from an institution. So you have had and I have had the maybe challenging journey of believing in yourself, choosing something that other people say is really crazy, sharing something and practicing something that maybe people think like, this doesn't make sense or you get rejected, but continuing to double down on that truth because it's emerging from the truth in you, from the life force.

in you. So then you find people, you collaborate, you were actually creating that new system organically. What is happening with the system is a lot of people, it's like a mass exodus. A lot of people are already burnt out, right? Burnout is not, let me get a remedy for burnout. Burnout is an indication that the foundation you're in is not going to create what's in your heart and what you're here to do. And so you want to jump out of that.

hot of boiling water, not just sit there trying to make it more comfortable. So there is a mass exodus from physicians, practitioners, awakening, who've been in the system, you know, they came in because they have this inspiration. And then it's like, oh, I guess that's where I'm supposed to go into this one system. And it teaches them only that perspective and that way of seeing it. It doesn't teach them that the body can heal itself, how to assist the body in healing itself, and that the body is actually creative.

meaning as within, so without your mind and your thoughts are affecting your physical. And so you leave that entire premise out, then you try to like, let's heal people. Of course you're gonna get burned out and they're not any better. Either people are so tired of that system. And so both practitioner and the patient are like, this isn't working. So it's kind of a mass exodus of what is gonna work. Now that approach, I mean, I was an ER doctor.

It is brilliant. Your arm is off, let's put your arm back on. You need a surgery, let's open up your bowel and put things together. Who knows? There is a huge role for it, but it's about 15 % of what we're currently using it for. And so when we have a true medical system, a conscious medical system, a medical system that understands the body has the ability to heal itself, that supports the body and the mind connection, and that understands we are creative, we are emanating.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (26:23.214)
an electromagnetic field and that that's what most powerfully affects the physical. We will have as part of that physical stuff we're doing, procedures, surgery, yeah, there's a role for it, but it's a fraction of what the actual system is really about. And so that's what we are stepping into now. People are awakening, practitioners are awakening. You may feel a calling and an inspiration to do this crazy thing that you're like, this doesn't even make sense yet, but.

I'm gonna keep moving forward and learning and moving in that direction. And that is really the new foundation for a conscious healthcare system.

Dr Peta Stapleton (27:00.128)
Yeah, and I think you're right, even mirroring that in the psychology world, you know, 20 years ago, you know, when I was sort of junior starting out, it probably, and I'd found EFT by then, but it probably took a good decade for colleagues to turn around and say, hey, what are you, what's this tapping thing that you're doing with clients or research or whatever? I'm looking for something now. Now what we're finding is our graduates get out within 12 months and they're coming back saying, because we still obviously teach fairly.

third wave, you know, absolutely evidence based but cognitive style therapies. But they're coming back within 12 months and saying, what else have you got? You know, they're not taking as long anymore. Could be a reflection too of the level of distress that is out there in the world that is accessing obviously therapy services. But yeah, I've found it's quicker. So I don't know if that's also that embracing at that level too in your world.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (27:47.534)
100%.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (27:55.822)
I found for me the whole as within, so without. If things were coming up in my personal experience with colleagues, skepticism, rejection, I would always look at what needs to shift in me that that doesn't show up anymore. And I remember this one, like when I was first starting out, I spoke at this event and I must have said something that had to do with divinity and God and the life force that flows through us and someone came after me.

to me after and said, your doctor, you shouldn't be talking about God. And I thought, that's pretty fascinating. What has you say that? Okay. And I thought to myself, let me take this in. I don't want to put anybody off that, cause there's a lot of meanings to that word versus like spirit or, you know, you can say whatever you want, but I thought, well, that's an interesting point of view. And I remember then just like kind of dissolving within myself anywhere I was resistant to the

The criticism, the skepticism, the negativity, the sometimes attack. You know, even going, I have a YouTube channel I love sharing. In the beginning, there would be like just ridiculous comments and I, but it would hurt. It'd be like, oh, there's rejection. So I would always remember, yeah, yeah, go within yourself. What is it bringing up in you? It's not about some random person out there. Clear in you where you attack yourself, where you doubt yourself.

Because if you know that you know, it kind of like parts the sea where you find the people who are like vibing with you, ready to work with you, ready to like, yep, life has beat me up enough to know I'm letting go of these conclusions I've held and I'm ready to receive this. So I've just seen it as like, I'm part of dissolving the skepticism, the fear, the perception, the doubt.

Doubt is so, when you talked about like emotions that are very suppressive and inflammatory, self -doubt is such a killer. It is like if we talk about like the number one killer, heart disease, yeah, no, no, no. Self -doubt is a way more prevalent killer and it's like invisible. So if you start to look at like, ooh, what comes up in me when someone's doubting me or challenging me or fill in the blank and you just like take it on, like I'm gonna.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (30:15.63)
Do the ABC tool, breathe right into where you're aware, because it's going to be uncomfortable. Where's the discomfort? Oh, yeah, maybe my chest. Let me just breathe that. Yes, yes, yes to this, right? Choose to be where I am. I'm going to say yes to this experience so I bring more life force to it, not less. So I think that's a big part of being a pioneer in this whole new system that is being created, the conscious medical system.

Dr Peta Stapleton (30:43.584)
And you're so right, like people often, you know, they might be starting out on their EFT journey and have all that self doubt about what will people think of me, let alone the fact that we now have lots of research. It's exactly what I did, because often people are, oh, why do you get so much support? And I'm like, well, just way back 20 years ago when I was getting that. And you know what? I absolutely attribute this to my cassette player with Louise Hay talking to me, driving around in the car back in the day, you know, and...

I'm sure none of my psychology friends realized that's what I was listening to, not somebody else. And Louise planted some seed and I'm like, okay, mirror, mirror, something comes up, it's a mirror. So I might've used tapping, I might've used another tool, but it's every time it came up where someone would reject or laugh or scoff, what's that stupid EFT tapping thing, I would just clear, clear, clear. And then it stopped happening. And so that's the only advice I give now. It's like, okay, you wanna open a practice? You wanna be...

you know, serving others and using tapping, just make sure that you're okay with that. And if you're not, it's just an experiment. When it comes up, see what comes up in you. Use whatever tool you want to to clear it. Yeah, I, yeah.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (31:52.462)
Yeah, you have one person to work on, not all the people out there. You clear this clear, you're literally a light bulb that brings a healing presence to everyone.

Dr Peta Stapleton (31:57.152)
I love it.

Dr Peta Stapleton (32:04.768)
And it reminds me, you know, of Ho 'oponopono, the, you know, spiritual Hawaiian spiritual technique, which Dr. Hugh Len put a link underneath if anyone hasn't read his book that he wrote with Joe Vitale about, you know, being a psychiatrist in a really, you know, high end lockdown psychiatric ward in Hawaii. And obviously lots and lots of violence and things they brought him in because he had this kind of practice and was known for getting

healings and things like that. And he used to sit in a room by himself with the client files and never see a patient. And within time, patients were released back into the community. No more of that violence happened. Staff retention got better. Everyone was happier. And he never, ever saw anyone. And everyone's like, and eventually the facility was closed down because there wasn't a need for it. And they're like, what were you doing? And all he was doing with the client file was reading it.

and saying what's in me that is reflected here and doing the work on himself and fabulous Ho 'oponopono technique if anyone.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (33:11.278)
And my practitioner doesn't know that feeling of the heaviness when someone's like, my fibromyalgia. And you all of a sudden feel this like, ooh, the obligation and like, oh God, I hope I can pull this off, the pressure. But if you have a tool to clear what arises in you, you don't take that energy on. You don't buy into your own self -doubt or limitation that...

The small self Kim is going to figure anything out. Yeah, right. No, the presence of the being that I am is going to do it. So I can keep that clear. Use Ho 'oponopono, which I love. I use that every day. It's a huge part of my work I do with when I'm working with people live. It is so powerful because he's really on it with the presence of life that comes through you is the healer. So if you're in a practice,

Dr Peta Stapleton (34:02.464)
Absolutely.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (34:03.95)
You just stay aware of all that stuff of maybe the physical sensations of like, oh, I'm so tired today. I got another patient. But if you take it deeper, it's the mental and the emotional of like obligation or inadequacy or, you know, whatever might be coming on because of the experience with that person. Clear what arises in you. The only patient is right here. And you do ho 'oponopono on yourself. And that's the premise of it is like, you're not ho 'oponopono -ing the patient.

Dr Peta Stapleton (34:29.408)
Yep. Yep.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (34:33.102)
It's all the universe is with you.

Dr Peta Stapleton (34:34.56)
Yeah, and if anyone's kind of, what is this? Ho 'oponopono, we'll make sure there's a link below. So absolutely go and explore it. Definitely read the book. It's a fabulous story. And Kim, just to maybe wrap up, because I know this is a part of your life and I'm just wondering where does it have a place, but you love movement. Now that might be movement to music. I've seen you in action.

dancing it out, like where is movement in the body and particularly as adults, you know, perhaps we've forgotten the little play aspect of social engagement and polyvagal theory. Play is an important part. Movement in the body, like, you know, whether that's to music or otherwise, where's the role of that?

Kim D'Eramo, DO (35:14.542)
Okay, so with that three part, like I found it to be so foundational, you're aware there's stuff coming out, the more presence you bring, the more soft body, the more is going to arise. Now you're like, what do I do with this? Well, there are three functions of your energy body. And one of them is you are a transmuter. Your body has the capacity to transmute the densest, darkest.

doubt, fear, shame, heaviest guilt. These are very low frequency energies back into pure light. And so breath, but also sound. If you're ever really in there and you just like, and don't be afraid of if it sounds ugly or if it's gonna scare somebody, arrange yourself accordingly, let your body sound. Then the other piece is movement.

So that's the whole yogic thing. I studied yoga for many, many, many years. I taught yoga. If you're breathing in this position versus breathing in this position versus breathing in this position, you're moving energy through your body in a different way. And so you can experiment with this. Like just be in flow, put a song on. And I love Elton John's sad songs say so much. If someone else is troubling enough,

to write it down. And every single word makes sense. It makes it easier to have those songs around. What is that? It's resonance. There's this resonance of someone who is sad, but they expressed it. And guess what? The resonance of the expression is going to touch the deep spaces of sadness that were buried in you.

That's why sometimes like a sad song actually makes you feel good. You're letting a resonance in of the pain or the fear. They hire these to hire whalers to go to a funeral and like express and make sound and move and like let that resonance come out because you got grief in there. Whether you're like, it's okay, I'll just stay busy and like you ignore it.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (37:26.158)
You want to move that grief. You don't want to store that grief. And so you get some sound in there or movement. You're going to cut Thars out and you could do it right now, like 40 years ago, trauma or disappointment or heartbreak or like whatever. When you're sick and you're not getting better, it's here now. You're carrying it around. We don't go to your past and like, let's dig up your past and rehash that trauma. You're working with what's here now. The body will show you what is here now related to this.

illness or this problem or you never have enough money or what's here now? And then we bring the resonance to literally catharsis that out of the body. And so for me, like move back, I've met some deep spaces in myself that like nothing was gonna EFT tap it out. So you gotta, you gotta use in the moment, what is the most powerful tool and movement, deep, slow.

rhythmic, you know, just presence will show you how to move is so healing.

Dr Peta Stapleton (38:29.344)
And it's funny, you know, we talk about the fourth wave in medicine, therapy, these fields, and these are not new techniques. These are culturally used around the world to this day and have been for hundreds of years, or they predate like all of us and have already been used, but perhaps put in a corner over here as to, you know, like I think of the primal screen therapies that we learn in our undergrad, they were like, oh, you're learning about these because you're not to use them and hitting a pillow and screaming and things like that.

Yet that was part of that process of release or that movement, trauma release exercises by shaking the body, shaking medicine. And have all had places and are still used and no one worries about how many RCTs are being published to prove it works. And now we're like, oh, the fourth wave. And it's like, no, they're already there.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (39:21.87)
your body's gonna show you that it works. You only need an N of one. And I only need an N of one. If I explore and I'm looking and I'm curious and I find something and I try it on my cancer patient and she doesn't have cancer anymore, that's enough for me. Let's move you. Like, that's great. Now, it's not, let's do this exactly same thing to every single person. What brought the medicine was the presence. Like if we practice A, then B, then C, A is...

We're so present, the body's going to tell us exactly what is needed. It's a needle in a haystack, but with deep listening, it's very apparent. So that's, I think, the true physician is the one who's really willing to look, to listen, to explore, to be open -minded, to release any disbelief and doubt so they can actually see what's right here.

Dr Peta Stapleton (40:11.776)
So true, so true. Kim, this has absolutely been a joy, not only for everyone who'll be listening in down the track, but even just to have this conversation with you and how far we have come perhaps in some of these traditional fields that are, and I guess what's heartwarming is they are opening up, we are opening up as a collective in our disciplines and fields and people are looking and accepting and at some level.

these things will be more mainstream than we realise. But just to have people like you in your corner of the world that are absolutely supporting people's healing journey. And if anyone wants to obviously connect with Kim, all her details are below. But thank you for sharing your journey, Kim, today and just where this field and the possibilities, what is possible.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (41:02.894)
everything is possible.

Dr Peta Stapleton (41:05.312)
I love that. It's just an N equals one, people. That is all it is. It's just about yourself. You don't have to worry about anything else.

So true. Thanks, everyone. We'll talk to you again soon.

Kim D'Eramo, DO (41:16.27)
Thank you.

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